Waypoint 101 –– We Know the Devil/Heaven Will Be Mine

This is the official forum thread for the current Waypoint 101 games, We Know the Devil and Heaven Will Be Mine!


Developed by Aevee Bee and Mia Schwartz (Worst Girl Games), We Know the Devil and Heaven Will Be Mine are visual novels that share themes of isolation and identity in strange worlds, both through the lens of three protagonists. We Know the Devil, released in 2015, follows three kids at summer camp told to confront the Devil. Heaven Will Be Mine, released in 2018, follows three women of different factions fighting/making out to decide the fate of space and humanity.

Content Warnings

Both of these games deal with themes of abuse, trauma, and body horror. We Know the Devil includes themes related to homophobia, transphobia (including misgendering), and religious abuse. Heaven Will Be Mine includes themes related to war and medical abuse.

Use this thread to discuss the Waypoint Crew’s streams on Twitch, the podcast episodes, and share your own experiences if you’re playing along!


I played and reviewed We Know the Devil back in October (I do 31 horror reviews in 31 days every year) Planet Blue: 31 Days, 31 Horror Reviews Day 26: We Know the Devil . Really enjoyed it for a quick little game.

I was hoping that Heaven Will be Mine would release on the Switch quickly afterwards but doesn’t look like we’ve had any luck. Looks like it only has a 2 GB requirement of RAM so even my shitty PC should be able to run it. Guess I’ll finally do that, I’ve never actually played a game that’s been featured on a Waypoint 101 before. :stuck_out_tongue:

(My beloved FFT is coming soon too so Waypoint is finally coming to me.)


Woohoo! These are great games and I’m glad waypoint is going to dig into them. There’s a small lack of coverage of games like these from Waypoint. Natural due to the current size and one of the reasons a new hire was so exciting.

Heaven will be mine is definitely one to dig into. On Austin’s 2018 goty list. Errant signal on YouTube has a pretty good video on we know the devil.


Renata and Cado streaming We Know the Devil, for anyone who missed it.

If you’d like to play it for yourself, you can buy WKTD on the Nintendo eShop, itch.io, or Steam for $6.66 (lol). The itch version also has a free demo that is a prequel to the events of the main game.

Heaven Will Be Mine is on itch.io and Steam for $14.99, or on the App Store for $4.99.


I nearly bounced clean off We Know the Devil. I didn’t mesh with the dialogue at all at first. By the end, I’d pretty much come around on it, but I did find the first few scenes difficult. The obvious answer might be that I’m way outside the target audience - I’m much older, among other key details, than the summer camp teens being depicted. I don’t know anything about the writers, or their ages, but once I watched the stream and heard Ren talk about it I was struck how the dialogue clearly resonated with her in a way it didn’t with me. It made me think that even if this dialogue is not necessarily accurate or realistic - and to be clear, I’m not saying it ought to be - it struck a chord. In any case, I ultimately thought it was a good little self-contained story, and one that I became more impressed by after watching the stream and seeing how the different endings play out.

On the other hand, I’m having more trouble with Heaven Will Be Mine. There was a beat early in that WKtD stream where someone in the audience asked, basically, ‘did I miss something?’. No, the game is just pretty obtuse about the way its world works and more is revealed as the story unfolds. Heaven Will Be Mine feels like that dialled up another 100%, layering big, unexplained, Proper Noun sci-fi concepts one on top of another in a way I’m currently having trouble keeping track of. In some ways, I really want to like it; it strongly reminds me of the Friends at the Table CW/Twilight Mirage/Partizan stuff, as well as anime like Evangelion. But, again, a lot of is just not landing for me. All the character voices are kind of blending together in a way that’s making it difficult to keep track of who’s saying what, and that’s on top of the jargon.

The choices are even more confounding. In WKtD, each choice is essentially “which characters do you want to pair up?” It’s pretty intuitive, even if it’s not clear how that will influence the outcome of the game. Once that does become clear, I really liked how it worked thematically, with the most left out character becoming the titular Devil and how it tied all the threads of alienation and exclusion and temptation together..

Early into Heaven Will Be Mine I have, uh, no idea what I’m choosing. On a meta level, I can infer that my choices will impact the end of the game, and that I’m weighting the narrative in the direction of different factions. Those factions have opaque goals and difficult to parse relationships with the characters [e.g. playing as Saturn, when she talks with Mercury they talk about not sharing the goals of the faction they belong to, but I barely understand what those goals are, so I don’t know if I want to try and agree or disagree with them…?], so it’s just multiple levels of abstraction I can’t currently get my head around.

Still: I’m relatively early in the game. I’m kinda hopeful that by the end of it I’ll come around on it like I did on We Know the Devil, and that all this will seem silly. Maybe not, and this one isn’t for me. Either way, I’m looking forward to the streams and discussions it provokes.

EDIT: Turns out I was not, in fact, relatively early in the game. I don’t think seeing the/an ending greatly changed my opinions above, though I felt like I could at least see what metaphor was being reached for.


The writing in the game is definitely in a style I find more common in modern SFF novels, leaning away from the ‘fish out of water’ protagonists like Harry Potter (ugh) or Naruto Uzumaki, and into a more ‘drop you in and let you figure it out’ style of storytelling. I enjoy that style a lot, but it definitely has its drawbacks the less straightforward the story or worldbuilding becomes.

I think Heaven Will Be Mine, in particular, also leans on an expectation that the player has not just a familiarity with shows like Neon Genesis Evangelion, but also the conversations people are having about those shows. Definitely fair to compare it to (the mecha seasons of) Friends at the Table.

Also: the first stream for Heaven Will Be Mine, for those who missed it. :milky_way:

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This made me realise I can’t remember the last modern sci-fi book I read - probably long enough ago that it’s not “modern”. I’m currently re-reading William Gibson’s short stories in Burning Chrome and I think it’s just pretty common for sci-fi, especially shorter fiction, to expect readers to fill in a lot of blanks on minimal info because there isn’t the word count real estate to hold their hand. I’ve never touched Naruto, but with Harry Potter, it makes sense that it’s a fish out of water story as it’s a simple mechanism for younger readers to be given a lot of information about a new world (not that it has to be this way - I always think of stuff like Ursula K. Le Guin or Ghibili movies like Nausicaa and Mononoke as examples of things much less hand-holdy but still approachable for children).

What’s striking to me about WKtD and HWBM is not so much the content as the… tone? Delivery? Dialogue that just doesn’t hit me in the same way and therefore I’m not processing everything it’s giving me. And that’s not a bad thing! I think fiction is more interesting when it isn’t built to cater to everyone. Much like with WKtD, watching the HWBM stream was instructive because I could see Ren and people in the chat reacting to lines from it in a completely different way. Like, oh, this lands for you, but flew right by me.


(I should really read more Gibson, I’ve only ever read Neuromancer and his script for Alien 3. :sweat_smile: )

Oh, the comparison to short stories is good, it does remind me a lot of the sort of things I read on Tor or Strange Horizons. A bit of Tamara Jerée, for example, but mixed with the diction and grammatical tendencies of - like - 2014-era tumblr (especially We Know the Devil). Perhaps that comes to mind for some of the touchstones, like the extended conversation Venus and Neptune can have about wanting to be Hufflepuffs but being sorted into Slytherin is something extremely early 2010s tumblr, to me.

It definitely dates the game, not just because tumblr is kind of dead but because having Harry Potter references in a game aimed at an LGBTQ+ audience is… unfortunate, in retrospect.


I won’t venture too far off topic in this direction, but I’d recommend Burning Chrome - some of the shorts are either in the same world as Neuromancer or have a similar ‘early cyberpunk’ flavour, but several are very different and demonstrate a lot more range than I think he’s later known for. With some big content warning caveats, Hinterlands from that collection is maybe my favourite work of his. (And I keep meaning to read his Alien 3 script!)

And oof, yes, the Harry Potter references are jarring. But then again, 2015 was a long time ago.


Playing Heaven Will Be Mine, and I definitely felt the distance from understanding exactly what each faction’s tangible goal was. But I found it more helpful to think more about how they were styled and what impressions that gave me of them. I played as Luna Terra first, who’s an old ace pilot working for the old guard Earth aligned faction. From that I got the idea of her as having the most ties to the existing establishment.

Definitely knowing Gundam helped a lot (especially as the show makes specific joke allusions to it), because I could just think in terms of “Oh LT is sort of the Amuro, and she’s working for the Earth Federation”. But even with the endings, I probably couldn’t tell you on paper what each faction’s goal was. But I did understand their position in the ideological conflict happening.


So, I played through Heaven Will Be Mine for the first time (with Saturn, because Celestial Mechanics is very obviously the metaphysically transhumanist faction from the start, and who doesn’t love metaphysical transhumanism, going 100% loyal).
I really didn’t have the same problems apparently some people have with the “levels of abstraction” here - it’s vague at the start, because it is, indeed, doing the “proper SF” thing of just throwing you into a situation and making you pick things up… but I grew up with that stuff, so I just enjoy it.
(And I say this as someone who has never watched any episodes of Neon Genesis Evangelion ever :wink: )

Obviously, there’s a layer of metaphor here which becomes increasingly clear as things go on, but even within the textual, rather than the metatextual, there’s some lovely things here. (Okay, so playful breaking of the fourth wall as an expression of “psychic” sensitivity to the shift of narrative around you has been done before, but I think this is a pretty beautifully done example of it.)
I also really liked the more thoughtful touches, like the way in which all the “outsider” planets are renamed as Greek rather than Roman deities to reflect their position relative to the “norm” created by Earth.

And, okay, so I know it’s the most emotionally resonant ending for me, probably, but… I really did cry over the ending. I’m kinda sad that I didn’t follow Austin’s recommendation way back when on Waypoint and play HWBM years ago…

[I’m also not really sure if I want to get the other 2? endings, since I’m probably not going to like them as much.]


God I love these games. The relationship between Pluto and Luna-Terra might be my favorite in like, all of fiction? In addition to just like, loving the Vibes of how their particular flavors of self-sacrificing compliment each other, it’s a rare treat to see two trans girls in love as one of like, the central pillars of a story.

Re: the faction’s goals, I think the game does a lot of work to put the focus on the relationships between characters rather than their abstract goals, even if those goals shape those relationships. The characters themselves care more about each other than their own factions, which each of them have a fraught relationship with. To me the important part of each choice is not which faction it benefits, but whether you want to see eg Luna-Terra or Pluto learn a lesson, which of these character should get the upper hand, and whether your POV character is “loyal” or “betraying” in this moment. I’m definitely the sort of nerd who loved digging into the nitty gritty of the worldbuilding, but I think the game can be fully enjoyed without worrying too much about what each faction wants to do. After all, none of them truly get their way in the end–the characters work together to carve out their own version of each ending.


As a side note on this: I particularly liked the Celestial Mechanics ending because it’s actually the ending I was expecting when I started that playthrough (before the various revelations make it clear that Iapetus, as well as being an asshole on other levels, also has an exceptionally cynical version of this plan in reality). So, Saturn does do the thing I most wanted from it in the beginning..

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Saturn was also my first choice, and remains my favourite ending after having seen them all, but all of them have their charm. Like @SuperBiasedGary, I came to this game with a familiarity with mecha anime like Mobile Suit Gundam and did the exact opposite and did Luna-Terra’s ending last since I probably dislike the Earth Federation more than Zeon or Anaheim Electrics or any other major Gundam faction, haha. But I do like her ending, if only because (spoilers for all endings) I am polyamorous, and the endings are all on some level about the women being together. Saturn’s and Pluto’s in more transhumanist ways - but Luna-Terra’s in a literal, cuddling in bed together way that hit me in the ‘oh I might start crying rn’ unexpected feelings way.

The Gundam parallels also reminded me a lot of this video, a sort of philosophy of dress and bodies and what mobile suits and Newtypism mean in that context. (Spoilers, after 13:45, for Mobile Suit Gundam.)


Oh I didn’t say but I played Luna-Terra first just because she was the first in the list, but also I dug the “I’m too old for this shit” vibes. That playthrough was basically where I figured out what everyone’s deal was.

When I knew the faction’s deals, I then played Saturn and had a ton of fun. The only thing better than Iapetus being a total shit is Saturn and Mercury’s relationship, loved that. I get attached to the support characters in these stories.


Also, having now also played (100% loyal) Luna-Terra/Memorial Foundation, and (100% loyal) Pluto/Cradle’s Graces…

…I both see what you mean about none of the factions actually getting their way - although, in the end, the “solution” produced by the pilot is usually an improvement of the faction’s worse solution (and I suspect that Dr Nix, at least, wouldn’t be totally unhappy with what Pluto decides to do in place of her plan).
As someone who, again, really likes “out there” worldbuilding, whilst I can see that L-T, in particular, has a harder-to-follow set of narrative clues to “how the world works” than Saturn does, I still actually think the setting is pretty parsable. (You just need to accept the fundamental worldbuilding mechanic that, in this version of reality, all kinds of gravitation and influence are really the same thing, not just metaphors for each other.)

I can also totally see why (according to the interview in RPS), Aevee Bee herself prefers the Cradle’s Grace ending. I think, certainly, being slightly less “in the middle” of the cultural context which HWBM is a metaphor for, frees me to endorse the, perhaps more radical, Celestial Mechanics ending.
(After all, humanity is overrated, right?).

Oh, also: whilst I don’t have cultural touchstones in Giant Mecha anime… I did feel like I got resonances with the more philosophical bits of the later R-Type games, when they decided to try to add a bunch of imagery and writing around “what is human, and what is an imitation of it?” into the bits between levels - it feels like a bunch of that echoes the writing around the “Existential Threat” here. And I liked those bits of R-Type the best.
[Well, that touchstone and also “This is How You Lose the Time War”, which also feels super relevant in lots of ways]

The second Heaven Will Be Mine stream is up. :robot:


I think my two favorite little details about We Know the Devil that I can’t stop thinking about are that:

Because of the nature of how endings are chosen, you’re likely to see people’s biggest devil foreshadowing during a playthrough that they don’t become the devil.

After God shows up on the radio and very clearly accuses one of them in particular of being the devil, the dialogue just after (Jupiter’s bargaining, Venus’s “it’s me,” Neptune’s “Don’t pity me”) shows that they’re all still convinced that they themselves are the devil. God will be like “Jupiter, it’s you” and Venus will be like “It’s me, isn’t it?”

I think those two go together really well to hammer home just how arbitrary and unfair the whole thing is


ICYMI: The Waypoint+ pod for this 101 is now live.

I won’t go too into it as it would partly just be rehashing points I already made above, but it was interesting seeing the crew react so unanimously positively to We Know the Devil and then be split on Heaven Will Be Mine, with the negative reactions mapping pretty closely to my own experiences with it.

I’m really looking forward to Ren’s essay that’s mentioned in the show but doesn’t seem to be live yet (given the work I’m sure she and Cado are doing prepping for the weekend stream, maybe it’ll drop after all that is done).


I’m halfway though this, since I’m also halfway through Heaven Will be Mine, but goddamn, Ren’s stories of her experience with WKTD are some of the best content Waypoint has ever produced. It’s the kind of thing that’s makes me bitterly jealous that I’ve never had a game leave any profound impact on me.

Curious why there’s any negative reactions to HWBM since only 50% of way through it, it fucking rules. I wish this was a full budget animated series, cause even just the descriptions of the powers at play are incredible and terrifying.