We Revisit And Reconsider Some Old Waypoints, Including 'Twin Peaks'


#1

It’s 2019, but we’re still looking back at 2018. We launched a super cool new podcast last year, Waypoints, that gave us an opportunity to discuss the slices of culture—politics, writing, theater, anime—that we were already obsessing about in private conversation. Some of our discussions were only about a single episode of a show or podcast, so it only seemed right to circle back and revisit some of the works that stuck with us, and how our feelings shifted. For this episode, that means digging even deeper into the classic TV show Twin Peaks and The City, a podcast about a garbage heap in Chicago, one that hides much darker problems.


This is a companion discussion topic for the original entry at https://waypoint.vice.com/en_us/article/pa59ny/we-revisit-and-reconsider-some-old-waypoints-including-twin-peaks

#2

I went down the same path Natalie and Rob did a short while before Twin Peaks’ season 3 dropped, and had a lot of the same feelings about season 1 and 2; which makes me very interested what they end up thinking about season 3, because I thought it was just kind of bad, pretentious, and weird for weirdness sake, and I feel like I’m kind of alone on that.
Fire walk with me I remember being pretty alright though.


#3

From what I can tell Aaron Rodgers family are crazy fundamentalists who he cut off because of their bigotry.

So, like, maybe don’t take his family’s side?


#4

TY to Natalie for repping the audience who knows nothing about sports we appreciate it.


#5

I did not know that they are crazy fundamentalists. I figured Rodgers probably has some reason to be estranged. if thats true its strange, considereing i think Rodgers is christian to (though he did have a great response a few years ago to Russell Wilson’s “God wills me to will” BS by going "i don’t think god gives a shit about a football game


#6

I’m not sure there’s actually evidence about what they clashed over because Rodgers has never come out and spilled the dirt, but this piece

has a ton about his politics and his beliefs on religion–and considering the political things he’s said aloud and the fact that he said he’s changed a lot, it’s not hard to think that the rift has to do with huge differences in religious and political beliefs. Or it could just be, as Olivia Munn has implied, that some of it is to do with them trying to climb on his shoulders to benefit their own careers and/or being jealous.

Or any number of other things—we’re all just ultimately guessing.


#7

Looking forward to hearing the Twin Peaks talk. I embarked on a huge rewatch of it as a treat after completing my studies. Season 1 to 3 (and FWWM, natch). What an experience that was. I can totally understand why some people were turned off by season 3, but it was pretty much perfect TV for me.

Thanks to Waypoint for turning me on to the Idle Thumbs rewatch podcast, which was a perfect accompaniment through it all (and helped distract me from the anxieties of starting a new job)


#8

For sure. I remeber reading a story a few years ago about the Rodgers family and how it was so sad that Aaron was estranged and they just wanted to talk to him! And i was bummed for like 15 mintues after reading until i realized that i had no idea about any of these people, and would never have the full story, so i probably shouldn’t take any side until proven otherwise.


#9

I can agree with that, for sure. I just think having grown up around Christian fundamentalists my whole life, and knowing what even the ones I get along with believe, my default assumption is that they have regressive beliefs.

I, myself, have considered cutting off parts of my family because of it but I never assume it would do any good, nor would I have the courage to do so. If Rodgers believes the things that he professes to publicly, I can see how regressive beliefs could cause you to cut off your family.


#10

Oh for sure. And yeah, i am no stranger to regressive fundamentalists, i do live in a red state. And i’ve thought about cutting off some of my family too, but i too have been reluctant. thinking about it, I’m probably more on Aaron rodgers side, knowing fundies, but speculation on family drama of rich people is like, ehhhhh, best without it imo


#11

On the topic of the social credit/credit check programs, I thought I’d link this Sarah Jeong piece from the Atlantic about the history of credit bureaus:


It gives some good context to how credit-checking enterprises have been circling around these kinds of ideas for a long time.


#12

I’ve technically seen every episode of Twin Peaks, but I made liberal use of the fast forward button after episode 15 (season 2 episode 8) (episode 16 chronologically) (what a perfectly Twin Peaks numbering system). I wish I could find the handy episode guide which tipped me off on which season 2 subplots to skip, but it essentially boiled down to James On the Road and Little Nicky

If anyone’s interested in alternate perspectives on season 2 in particular, I’d recommend Diane, a very good Twin Peaks recap podcast. They’re superfans and sometimes err on the side of rationalising season 2’s problematic (in every sense) elements, but they’re also critical and offer valuable insights.

For my part, while I understand recommendations to go straight from the killer reveal to the last 2 episodes, I’m very glad I checked out the stuff in between. I especially wouldn’t want to miss a second of Al Strobel’s Philip Gerard.


#13

The rewatch podcast I listened to made the season 2 slog a lot more enjoyable for me (as did my own exceedingly low expectations, which made a lot of it seem a lot better than I’d remembered it). It’s kind of frustrating that it never gets so bad that you can just skip it: there’s always something interesting in even the weakest episode (I really like Josie getting stuck in the wooden drawer handle, specifically for the eerie strangeness of Pete seeing her face in the wood a couple of episodes later: it’s a weird little detail that I love in part for the fact that it goes nowhere).

I have to say I’m a legit fan of the Little Nicky storyline now. Dick Tremayne is now one of my favourite weird Twin Peaks characters. The guy’s a hoot.


#14

Currently rewatching s2 and I’m not finding it completely awful. The Twin Peaks charm is still there. I find the ‘weird for the sake of weird’ argument is true in places, but at the same time those are the places I love. (I kinda love the super-strength Nadine sub-plot).

There are irredeemable areas (cough James), but the ongoing mythos and charm makes up for that. And like a few people have said, there are still legitimately great moments in s2. One thing which took me by surprise on this rewatch was how much of the Major Briggs story I’d forgotten - the opening to “The Black Widow” was one of these.


#15

I like Josie’s fate for the spike into supernatural territory and the surprise BOB appearance, but the story that leads into it is some of the worst of Twin Peaks, for its unexamined racist tropes and poor treatment of women. Again, the Diane podcast collates some great thoughts about Josie’s significance in Twin Peaks.


#16

I listened to Twin Peaks Rewatch before watching seasons one and two of the television show. I really enjoyed that podcast.


#17

I really like the Windom Earle stuff in S2. And hell, I enjoyed Nadine’s bizarre storyline.


#18

One point about Nadine that I hadn’t realised until my recent rewatch

She has the super-strength for one short scene in season one, which is otherwise a non-sequitur


#19

There are some of the bits that I really enjoyed purely down to some absolute pro performances.

Ed’s first reaction to teenage reverted Nadine is incredible

Richard Beymer is an absolute pro

Dick Tremayne is a major joker

Michael Ontkean being out of his depth when being directed to yell is quite funny

Actually quite enjoyed s2 this time round, tbh.

Listening to the podcast rn and I’m so glad Austin is hyping everyone up for how good s3 is.


#20

I never finished s3 because my sub ran out but I halfway enjoyed it, halfway found it frustrating. I wonder how everyone will react to some parts of the story.